Liberation After Loss: Redefining Identity, Power & Purpose — with April Joy

Liberation After Loss: Redefining Identity, Power & Purpose — with April Joy

Norbert Orlewicz: Welcome to Between two Coaches, a Digital Mentors podcast for coaches, consultants, authors, speakers, and experts. I am your host, Norbert Orlewicz and in each episode we've got a conversation with successful and emerging thought leaders in the mentoring industry to share their experiences in insights and practical strategies to help us all make a bigger impact with our work.

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Alright, today's guest is April. Joy. Really excited to have her here on this show and share her incredible story with you. April Joy is a liberation coach and public speaker who primarily helps women entrepreneurs and professionals in midlife to stand authentically in their truth.

Harness their personal power and be liberated from their past. She's been coaching and training people for over 15 years and has just released her brand new glow transformation program. April, welcome to the conversation. It's awesome to have you.

April Joy: Thank you, Norbert. It's great to be here. Appreciate you having me today.

Norbert Orlewicz: Yeah, exciting. Awesome. Fantastic. Well let's get this conversation started here. We got a lot to talk about, a lot to dig into. Uh, and so I'm gonna start out with this question 'cause it'll lead really nicely into your story. Um, coaching obviously is about transformation. I. Right? Mm-hmm.

So what's been your most life-changing and impactful transformation in your life, and how did it change you and perhaps even your approach to coaching?

April Joy: Absolutely, and, and this is such a powerful conversation because I think oftentimes anyone who gets started in their business, it's because of a personal. Experience and that personal experience is what really drives us into typically new directions. And, and I had some interesting, I'll call them life events over the last, uh, few years.

And I, I come from a really big family. Uh, the youngest of seven children, I. And very unexpectedly. I lost five immediate family members in about four years.

Uh, I lost three brothers, a mom and a dad. I also filed for divorce from a marriage I was in for eight years with him for 10, and I had a major medical procedure.

And a lot of that happened in about a year and a half timeframe. So I think whenever you undergo that amount of change in such a short period of time, it forces you to have what I call the meeting with Jesus in the mirror, right? You meet with Jesus and say. You know, is this really what I'm supposed to be doing with my life, or should I be doing something different? And that's really the process that I went through. And at the end of the day, I ask myself what I call the hardest question ever, which is, do I really enjoy the way my life is looking right now? Do I like what it looks like? And the answer was a hard no. Hard. No, not a soft no, but a hard no. 

And so that was really the point of transformation where I said, you know what? I get the opportunity to reinvent myself. I have the opportunity to do something different. And I'm gonna be speaking actually here very soon, on resilience and rediscovery through loss, um, at an engagement, uh, here this week. And the event Holder said, how would you describe reinvention or rediscovering yourself through loss?

And I called it a passage. A passage into possibility. Because there are things that you will discover about yourself after experiencing those types of losses that you probably would've never have discovered if those things would not have taken place. And so I'm in a new realm of possibility, um, and I'm on the other side of it, and I'm super grateful,

Norbert Orlewicz: wow, that's incredible. I mean, I just have to pause for a second and just, you know, really live with what you just shared there. I mean, that is so much to take in, in a lifetime, but to take it in in a short amount of time to have all those horrible things happen to you, how do you not crumble? 'cause I mean it's so, there's so many pressures on us in so many different ways and you know, for all different kinds of people in different ways.

April Joy: Sure.

Norbert Orlewicz: How do we not crumble under the weight of this crisis sometimes that we're facing these difficult challenges that all of us are going to face. If you haven't, you're going to at some point, what is it that got you through that and got you to see opportunity in such an awful situation.

April Joy: I think so much of it, nob just boiled down to understanding a couple of things. Number one is reconciliation with the life that I had with these people, right? Mm-hmm. And, and just owning that and. Having great memories and just cherishing the time that I did have with my loved one. So I think the first thing is just reconciling that within yourself, and I'll be honest, when after I lost my mom, I probably went radio silent for about six weeks.

Like you couldn't find me on social. People were texting me and I was like, no, I need to. Sit with this one, you know? And so that, that's what was happening was just that reconciliation process of just understanding, um, what it really meant to. Be Ronnie's daughter, you know? And just to take the time to really look at the life that I had with her and the impact that she had on me.

I think oftentimes people don't take enough time there, right? I think they try and rush through that and people are trying to send them food and take 'em out and get 'em outta the house. And I, I think you can't really rush that process.

Norbert Orlewicz: So you really, you really gotta sit in that experience in the ugliness, in the.

April Joy: Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think you gotta, I think you gotta sit in it for a little while and, and just reconcile like, okay, this was the life that I, that I had with this person.

This is the impact that they had on me. So that's the first thing. And I think the other big piece of it was just really getting to a place of understanding that my life was going to be different now. It was gonna look different like our family unit shrunk, you know, we used to have these huge, you know, get togethers and Thanksgivings, and now it's like a tiny group of us, right? And so redefining roles, redefining what family looks like. That was a, I'll be honest, we're still in that place, right? Because my mom was, you know, the matriarch and my older brother was kind of the patriarch after my parents separated. And so when those matriarchs and patriarchs are gone, it's like, okay, who steps in? 

Who steps in to take on those roles. And so we're still hashing that out. Okay. We haven't completely figured it out yet, but just understanding that it's gonna be different. You can't just think that your life is gonna look the same because you have a different life now. It looks different and it feels different. And just getting clear with that, knowing that it is gonna be different is a big. Piece of that passage into possibility and redefining what that's gonna look like for you.

Norbert Orlewicz: So this makes me think of, uh, I went through a divorce now 13 years ago or so, and I have to say probably one of the most challenging things for me was trying to redefine my idea of family.

April Joy: Yes.

Norbert Orlewicz: I, I grew up with a, with a family, you know, my parents had their issues, but they stayed together until my father passed away.

And I had always imagined having a family, you know, a mom and a dad and kids and dinners together, and vacations together and all that kind of stuff. And we separated. We divorced when my kids were pretty young. And so that was the biggest loss that I felt was this idea that I had a family. That was not possible at all.

Like there was no getting that back.

April Joy: Mm-hmm.

Norbert Orlewicz: Is that where this, like when you talk about this passage to possibility, is that where this theme kind of comes in? Because I know I, I dealt with that for years before I could come to peace with it.

April Joy: Yes, it, it really does. And, and that really is what brought me to the place of that powerful word, which is the word that I stand on and everything I do, and that word is liberation. To be liberated from the societal norms. I'm a 45-year-old woman, unmarried, no kids. I'm like a unicorn. Okay, I am a unicorn. Like how many 45-year-old women do you come across who are single with no children? It just, it's just rare. It's rare, right? And so I began to embrace. And be liberated by possibility of, you know what? I get a chance to define what being 45 single and no children looks like, because let's be honest, we live in a pretty per patriarchal society, right? And, and we have this image of what nuclear family is supposed to look like.

And so to be able to defy those odds and say. I can have a beautiful life. I can have tremendous impact, and it doesn't require me to birth a baby outta my birth canal. In order for me to experience that. And I've met a great guy, you know, we've been dating for about eight months now.

He's got two older children who are amazing. Um, but I'm, I'm grateful that. I was able to redefine, like you said, what family actually looks like because it doesn't have to look like what my family looked like, right?

Norbert Orlewicz: Right. Yeah. And that's probably a lot of the work that you do with your clients is helping them redefine their, their identity, because many times we have an identity tied. To that, right? Like, I wanted to be the good dad and the good father. And so how can I be that if I don't have a family, right? Like it shatters my identity.

so redefining your identity, redefining what's possible, and redefining almost a, like, redefining the story that you tell yourself about the situation as well. That's gotta be a, a key part of it because we're always. We're always, um, creating meaning around stories, around events, around happenings,

and I guess we get to choose the meaning that we, that we put on the thing, the event or the happening.

Right?

April Joy: yes. You're spot on. You're spot on. So I'm gonna pick up that nugget and take it a few yards down

Norbert Orlewicz: Yeah. Please.

April Joy: so we decide what things mean. that was a huge revelation for me through this entire process. So. Yes, I was married for eight years filed for divorce because I just literally woke up one day and said, I am not fulfilled. I am not fulfilled, and I deserve to be fulfilled. And so being able to really look at that divorce and just say, that was an experience that was about 10 years of my life, I now know exactly what I don't want. Right. And there's a lot of power in that because sometimes you don't know what you want until you know what you Don't want.

Right.

And so, um, and just really learning to, uh, acknowledge and to not, allow myself to disregard the things that are really important to me when it comes to relationship. Right. And that was a big one for me too. So I'm uncompromising in those things now once I put my foot down, right? And so I'm, I'm uncompromising in that area and, and not any kind of like spiteful way, but I'm standing in that, in that honorable truth, I'm being a person of integrity and stating very clearly. Uh, what I want and, and, and if what you want and what I want meets up, great. Then let's have a conversation. But if it doesn't, that's okay too, right? but but for years, I allowed myself to think that the things that I wanted were not okay. That it was okay for me not to have them because I was in service to this other person. And I think as women, men do it too. But I, I can, I'm only speaking from the female perspective. I think we do this a lot. We put ourselves in service to our clients, to our children, to our spouse. I was also a caregiver. I didn't even go into that. So I was a caregiver for four and a half, five years before my mom passed away.

So I'm in service to her. So I'm in service to all these other people, but I was not really in service to my highest good.

Norbert Orlewicz: This is a big theme that keeps coming up. And it's mainly, I think because of our age. You know, I'm, I'm creeping up to the big five oh myself, uh, and these are the conversations that I have with my wife because we both kind of realized that. As you get into middle age, you get into your later forties and then into your fifties.

You know, you talk about the crotchety old people that are set in their ways and you know, you, I used to think about that really negatively, but I'm like, no, I just know what I like and what I don't like, and I'm not gonna put up with the BS anymore. And I think that's an important. Passage. It's an important shift that happens for us in middle age, where, you know, in our twenties and in our thirties maybe we put up with stuff.

We tolerated stuff,

but we're getting closer, you know, to the second half of our life, the better half of our life. There's no more time for that. And so what, what is it about this time and, and I think maybe this is an important passage that we need to go through in middle age where we kind of re-clarify our identity.

I think this is one of the most important times of our life. We kind of think about it as like, oh, you know, middle age and it's all downhill from here. Like, those are the things we used to say. I just don't subscribe to that anymore because it's now that I finally know who I am and what I want and how I can really show up, I mean relationships.

I had no freaking clue what I was doing in relationships until after my divorce, right? Like there's so much to be learned and there's so much to be discovered about ourselves at 

April Joy: Yeah. Yes. Oh, you're spot on. You're spot on. Uh, so when we reach halftime, that's what I call it, right?

We're coming up on halftime. When you start to come up on halftime, there is a very powerful reckoning, I believe that starts to happen. And I have a hypothesis. I'm actually gonna be working with a PhD researcher to help me put some research behind it.

But here's the hypothesis. The hypothesis is, is the most undervalued. People in society are women between the ages of 45 and 75, and here's why, because they're undervalued. One, and I'm, I'm gonna keep this one very real, is we are outside of childbearing years. And so there's this automatic like devaluation that happens in, in the minds of many people in society once a woman is outside of childbearing. Now, for the woman, our value in our mind goes way up. Why? Because one, we're probably empty nesters or getting close to it. So we're beginning to feel a sense of liberation from that. We also become very clear, like you said, about what we want and what we don't want. There is extreme clarity that begins to happen in that season of life, and there's tremendous wisdom dumb that we now have to offer.

And I honestly think that for those women that are in, uh, corporate. Corporations are missing out on this. They're not hiring these women that are 50, 55 and 60 and, and I think it's a huge miss because if they are not valued by these companies, then guess what they'll do. And this is what they're doing, by the way, as they start their own businesses.

Norbert Orlewicz: course. Yeah. Yeah.

April Joy: Like I did, right? So they start their own businesses and they begin to really understand what their tangible value is in the marketplace and that it has a true monetary value and they can get paid for all of this wisdom that they have. So that's the, that's the hypothesis. Like I said, more to come on that. But I do think that that is a very powerful part of that rite of passage.

Norbert Orlewicz: Well, you know, I, we, we work with a lot of people in middle age, just seems to be the people that we, that we attract into, into our community. Um, and you know, I, I always say that based on Jim Rohn's teachings, Jim Rohn said that we get paid as entrepreneurs, we get paid for the value we bring to the marketplace.

Right?

And I'm always, I've been so amazed by how much most people undervalue themselves.

Right? But here's the cool thing about this value, the, this value is what we naturally bring to the market. So it's our skills, it's our experience, it's our talents, it's our abilities, it's our, you know, certifications.

It's our expertise. It's all these things that the older we get, the more value we have to offer.

April Joy: Yes.

Norbert Orlewicz: So it's a shock that, you know, what is it that corporations and companies are looking for that they don't think they're going to get from a middle-aged person who now has the wisdom and the experience?

They're not making the same mistakes that kids in their, and they are, kids in their twenties we're making, are making right.

It's a bizarre culture shift. It's an interesting culture shift, and I think that the shift will be more towards valuing people as they get older because we haven't been doing that so much, and it's, it, it's, for me, it's incredibly inspiring to see people in their forties, in their fifties, and even in their sixties.

Transitioning careers life and making bold, bold decisions and bold choices. To move forward into this next chapter, you talk a little bit about risk.

April Joy: Yeah.

Norbert Orlewicz: How important is taking risks? Because I mean, as you know, we're all different and some people just have, don't have much of a risk tolerance. I'm one of these people that I, I, I'll take risks, so I'm not a problem for me.

I'll take risks, I'll change my life at 60, not a big deal, but how do you deal with these people that may be, are a little bit more timid around risk? Where does risk come into the picture here?

April Joy: There there's always gonna be some level of risk, right? I mean, I, I took a flight a couple weeks ago. I. There's a risk there, right? Um, I, I think we just have to redefine that and, and begin to understand that not only is risk just a part of life, but it's also a very empowering place to be because it's where you really get a chance to see, I think your full potential. 

We often don't get an opportunity, see our full potential when we are consistently in our comfort zone. And so if you really want to see your full potential, put yourself in a place where you have some moderate risk. And so when I, you know, I spent quite a few years in the direct sales and network marketing industry, built a business to over 200,000 a year with my, um, with my ex-husband. And it was a risk when I walked away from that building. I mean, I spent 15 years, I mean all my whole thirties was there, right? And so what was that? A risk? Yes, it absolutely was a risk, but I had to understand and begin to quantify my value. as I began to quantify my value and I, I went back and just started asking myself questions like, April, think of all the things that you have done right?

Think of all the things that you have done. You've written a book, you've done multiple women's coaching programs. You have been coaching and inspiring people since you were like in your twenties. I think my first public speaking engagement, I was like 24 years old. Okay? And so. And when I really began to quantify all of that value, I realized that I had hundreds of thousands of dollars of value that I had been giving away for free for years.

I'm talking decades, right? I wish I would've got paid every single time that I became the go-to girl for my direct sales company. I was in every video I was on. I mean, I was like the face. Of the company, right? And so when, when you, when we really begin to ask ourselves those questions, like, wow, what are all the things that I have done?

I think most people would be shocked at how, how much they have done. But, but you know, my, as my girlfriend said, you gotta, you gotta take out all your receipts. I got receipts. I got receipts of all my value, but it really takes time to sit down and to begin to write all those things out and to, and to consider just all the things that you've done for friends, family, colleagues, for free. Right? I had many people reach out to me over the years and say, Hey, April, I've got an engagement coming up. Can you gimme some tips? Guess what? Those tips cost now, right? Because I'd give you all these tips and oh my God, it went so should been charging for that stuff. Right. So yeah, it's, it's, um, the, the risk tolerance grows when you actually begin to quantify your value.

Norbert Orlewicz: This is, I think, where the value of coaching really comes in

because I don't think most people take the time and have the, the insight and the perspective to really appreciate where they've come from. Right, and I mean, I, I think that's probably one of the big benefits of coaching. This is where we can come in as a coach, is just to offer a new perspective,

April Joy: Yes.

Norbert Orlewicz: a new insight into a person's experience.

Can you share a little bit about that, you know, in your coaching process and maybe some experiences where you've been able to do this for other people? 'cause I know it's happened for me on multiple occasions.

April Joy: Well, a big part of my work is on what I call going from blind spot to breakthrough,

and so we all have blind spots. We have blind spots as it relates to, you know, how we show up. We may think we're showing up one way, but the way people are perceiving us is something different.

Norbert Orlewicz: Mm-hmm.

April Joy: Uh, some of it is just not really understanding, and I love this term.

I've been using it ever since I heard it. A friend of mine, um, who is a guy who got, uh, laid off, just, they let him go $400,000 a year job at a major nonprofit, just you're no longer needed.

Okay? And so he's going through the same process right now, packaging his value, and he uses this term. It's so powerful. And he said it's important that we all begin to understand what we have organic mastery in. And I said, oh, I love that. What do you have? Organic mastery in things that you don't really have to work that hard at. Or maybe you worked hard at it before and now it comes really easy to you, but may be really difficult for someone else. Right. So for me, doing this with you com comes kind of natural for me, but for others, this is like major stage fright.

Norbert Orlewicz: Yes. Right.

April Joy: imagine talking into a camera behind a mic for 30 minutes. So understanding what you have, organic mastery in packaging that, and then being able to offer that. To people who do not yet have organic mastery in that area is where there's real possibility for us as coaches.

Norbert Orlewicz: Yeah, that's it. I love that. Organic mastery. Yeah. That's, that's the value that you bring. That's awesome. So let's talk about your, your, your branding, your concept, uh, your word liberation. You, you, you call yourself a liberation coach. You talk about finding liberation, uh, in everything in life. I, I really resonate with that word 'cause I'm all about freedom.

And I despise injustice. Like those are the, that's like, that's the thing that just gets me riled up. So when you talk about liberation, you're, you're speaking my language, but what do you mean by that? When you talk about liberation, liberation from everything, that's such a big, profound statement.

April Joy: Yeah, so when, when I talk about liberation, it really applies to virtually everything in our lives because we are bound in more ways than we can imagine. And we're bound in three big primary ways, number one, by what we have read or listened to by the people that we have been surrounded by. And then we're also bound by just the indoctrination of society in general.

Right. So when I talked earlier about. Me being a unicorn, right? 45. Single dating. Single dating, but no children. That's an indoctrination. That's an indoctrination by society that says if you're 45 and you don't have kids, there must be something wrong with you. What's wrong with her? Right? I mean, people are shocked when they find out that I don't have kids, like, not even one.

I'm like, no. I don't, I mean, I love kids. I just, that's just not how my life unfolded.

Right? And I'm at peace with that. Like I'm more than at peace with it. I'm actually standing in power in that place, you know?

I'm like, I'll just be like the next Oprah. It's all good, right? So and so it is. Those are the areas where we get bound.

And so when you really begin to think about that. We have a lot of liberation that has to take place. We've been bound by the things that we were taught. My brother, Kurt, says what we've been told, taught, and thought. Okay, so what we've been told, taught and thought through the companies that we've worked for, the family unit that we grew up in, right?

The friends that we had, the teachers and professors that we've had, the bosses that we've had. Now with social media we're in, we're bound in a whole nother way,

Norbert Orlewicz: Oh my god. Yeah, we're by our echo chamber and the algorithm. Oh my.

April Joy: my gosh, right? And so it's like we have all of these talking heads from the day that we're born that are in our ear feeding us all of this data. Because of the way the human brain brain works, we really don't have a filter for that. So we're like a sponge. We're just taking it all in. 

And so it requires us to get liberated from all of that stuff so that we can begin to live a life of freedom, authenticity, and integrity. And I gotta talk about integrity. I had a whole new understanding of integrity. Over these last few months, and you know, people think about integrity of, okay, I'm a person of my word. That's how most people think about integrity. But if you really think about integrity, I love what my one friend said, she lives in Chicago. Her name's Paula.

And Paula said, without integrity, nothing works, nothing. This glass

Norbert Orlewicz: Oh.

April Joy: is in integrity, it's working. If it's out of integrity, that means the water will not hold within this glass. So using that as an example, think about all the areas of your life where you have leaks, right? We all have leaks. We're out of integrity in some area, whether it's. We say one thing and we do something else. We say, we're gonna show up at five o'clock and we show up at five 15. We say that we're going to, uh, you know, be there for a friend and we're not. So we're out of integrity and without integrity, nothing works. I knew I was out of integrity in my marriage. I was acting like everything was great. I had a great face on. I mean, I was, I should get an Oscar. That's how good of an actress I was. Give me my academy award 'cause I should have 10. Okay. I was putting on the face in front of everybody that we lived this great life and it was like, never let 'em see you sweat. I lived that for 15 years. I was out of integrity. Out of integrity. And you know how I knew. Is every single time my integrity like really peaked, like I was out of integrity, like at a high level, my body would respond. Great book. The body keeps the score right? And so the body always knows what's going on inside the mind. Even if you think your cortisol level's fine, it's probably not. So my stress level would start to go up. I'm think I'm, I'm okay, but I wasn't. And then all of a sudden I would have a hive outbreak and just. Hives all over my body. Why? Because I was out of integrity. So if we find ourselves getting sick, if we find our, if we find ourselves with, uh, you know, stress being kind of stuck in different parts of our, of our body, some, some of us hold it in our neck, some of us hold it in our back, some of us hold it in our heart.

That's where the heart attacks come from. Most women hold it in their womb space. That's why they have PCOS fibroids and all these other female reproductive issues. When we hold all of that stress and that stress is often coming because we are out of integrity, as soon as you get back in integrity, your body kicks back into homeostasis. So I have a totally different. Understanding of integrity. And probably one of the most powerful moments that I had that I don't really talk to my ex-husband very much, but I called him and I said, look, I wanna apologize for being out of integrity. I apologized and I said, we weren't happy. You know it, I know it, but we pretended like we were the pretty much the entire marriage. And I said, I, I, I, I gotta own that. I'm gonna own.

Norbert Orlewicz: How, how powerful was that Mo? And you just said it was one of the most powerful moments where you called him and took full responsibility. I did. I did that with my ex-wife too. I, I texted her. And, and, and I acknowledged my, my role for, for the, the demise of our, of our marriage. That was one of the biggest things that gave me liberation,

was taking full responsibility for how I screwed up in the relationship.

You know, we weren't perfect. We each contributed

to the demise of our relationship, and yet I was able to take full responsibility for, for my, my side of things. What, uh, what an important step that is.

April Joy: Very, very, that's a big part of liberation, not just for you, but also for that other person. See, we have to understand that all these different people, they come into our lives for different reasons. And whatever he was supposed to learn, hopefully he learned it right. Um, before he goes into his third marriage. Right? And so I, I truly said I've got to take responsibility for the part that I did play. Then ultimately it's gonna be up to him. And this doesn't have to do with just a marriage. This could be a friendship, this could be contention between two family members, right? An old business partner who screwed you over outta money, right? Um, it doesn't matter what, where that lack of integrity is, but if you knew, if you suspected that someone was stealing from you inside the company and you didn't say anything, you're out of integrity.

Norbert Orlewicz: Integrity and the, the being whole or undivided.

April Joy: Ah. Right. So that's what most of us are doing. Most of us are not whole, and

Norbert Orlewicz: No, we're not. I mean, we have to, we just have to admit, you know, we, we, we talk about that core value of integrity and we say that we value integrity and we try to show up with integrity. But let's be honest, I mean not, I don't think any human being is in full integrity, right? We can strive for integrity, but there's always gonna be some place where that shows up.

Um. Tell me a little bit about your new program coming out. 'cause this has been in the works, you've got a YouTube channel that you're just launching a podcast and you've got your new, uh, program, the Glow Transformation. So let's just tell us a little bit about that program before we wrap up here.

April Joy: Absolutely. I'm so excited about Glow Transformation, that it's kind of been in beta test mode since December, but we're gonna be launching it full force here over the next couple weeks. And Glow is, it really stands for for things. So the G stands for growing in your self-confidence and discovering.

Your purpose. So you really, I take it through a process to uncover what your purpose is. That's a big part of liberation,

right? So that's the G. The L stands for leverage. Your story. It's, it's really painful to show up at a networking event and to see someone stand up and give their 62nd pitch. They're stumbling over their words and they just really don't know how to articulate what it is that they do with impact. And that's a lot of people

Norbert Orlewicz: Mm-hmm.

April Joy: actually. Okay. And so showing people how to really develop their story, leverage their story so that people wanna listen to what they have to say, right? Like, I know my story. My name is April Joy and I am the president, CEO. Of the April Joy Media Group, and our mission is to elevate voices to lead important conversations, and we do that by telling stories of power, perseverance, and purpose. I got it down.

Norbert Orlewicz: Nice.

April Joy: Okay, so we leverage your story. Always own your voice. This is a big part of liberation. Most of us have not really been taught how to own our voice. We shrink back. We hide behind others. We hide behind past mistakes, right? And so learning how to really come true and stand in personal power about. Your past, your present, and where you're going in your future. And to be able to do that in an online format or in an offline format, somebody may want you to come in and speak to their organization's employees, or somebody may want you to come speak at, you know, the panel, right? A panel conversation, and you're like, uh. So teaching them some skills on how to stand confidently in that space. And then W stands for WIN for Within. So WIN For Within is showing you how to really identify and encapsulate your core values to develop a personal brand that most authentically reflects who you are, but speaks most importantly to your ideal client. And so I'm very excited about global transformation. Um, we're seeing some great results already just from the test group and really looking forward to launching this full scale the next couple weeks.

Norbert Orlewicz: I love it. Awesome. Well, you're gonna be a fantastic person to facilitate and, and lead that. I'm excited for the people that join that, uh, that program. So where can people connect with you? Obviously, we're gonna leave links and all that in the descriptions and uh, the show notes here. But just tell people where they can find you online.

April Joy: So the best place to find me and where you'll see us dropping all of our episodes for The Liberation Lounge, where we have real talk with real women every single week, but you can find me on YouTube and my handle is at April. Joy and Powers. I'm actually. That's the handle for everything. So Facebook, Instagram, LinkedIn is at April.

Joy Empowers is where you can find me, but we would love to have your comments on our YouTube channel.

Norbert Orlewicz: All right. Fantastic. All right guys, we'll have those links there. April, thank you so much for being here. This has been a really great conversation. Really enjoyed having you here, and really excited for this next chapter of, of your life and for your business. Um, so yeah, just really wanna, uh. So have gratitude for, you know, being involved with you and being able to, to watch you grow over the last few years.

It's awesome to see.

April Joy: Thank you. It's been a pleasure.

Norbert Orlewicz: Fantastic. Alright guys, well if you enjoy this, uh, this episode, uh, please help us to grow this growing podcast as well. Please share it with your network and audiences. Be sure to subscribe, leave a review, all that good stuff. And if you're a coach, consultant, trainer, or expert, and you're looking for some clarity in your marketing and client acquisition strategy, join us for that Digital Mentors Compass workshop.

Again, the website to register for free is Compass. workshop.com. Alright, thanks again for joining us here. Thank you April, for this amazing conversation. This has been a conversation between two coaches.